Abortion

really? like ** yourself
we blow up babies everyday overseas...
but lets not abort the ** baby
that really makes sense
its called pro choice bc its YOUR right to choose
so if YOU dont want abortion then go ahead and keep the thing.
but leave the rest of us alone
and besides any emotional things, if we didnt abort so many babies we would be incredible over crowded, those babies would prolly be living on the streets and in crackhouses...
oh and there wouldnt be any food for your fat judgemental **

Ok so let me get this straight. God knows everything we’re going to do so we have no choice in the matter. He knows who will be rapists, murderers, pedophiles, thieves, slave owners, and tyrants. In your opinion these people can’t help themselves because God already knows. We should stand by and let them have all the fun they want in the world. Is that right? Just because God knows everything does not mean we don’t have a choice.

Furthermore, you scream “bible thumpers” and in my last post I did not mention one thing about God. In the post before my last one I stated “Also I'm not pro-life because of religion; I'm pro-life because it is MURDER.” Yet YOU always bring this back to God.

You have only answered one of my questions from my previous post. I’m starting to think that arguing with you is pointless. Your best arguments are “The right to choose” and “God knows we’re gonna do it anyways, why not”. What this all comes down to is philosophy. If you believe it is acceptable to take the life of another out of mere convenience then we will probably never come to any kind of agreement. I believe that EVERY HUMAN has the right to live.

"Yet that woman has the right to take the life of her own child?"
Yes. According to U.S. law she does. I repeat - There are no laws in place to prevent a woman from having an abortion... at any stage of her pregnancy.

Now, regarding free will:
There is no Scriptural basis for the teaching of free will. The bible conclusively states that God has predetermined everything that ever will be.

Ephesians 1:4 "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:" (the saved were chosen “before the foundation of the world”)
Ephesians 1:11 " In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:" (God’s will)
Romans 8:29-30 "(29) For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. (30) Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified." (God has already predetermined who is saved)
2 Thessalonians 2:13 "But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth." (God has already chosen the saved “from the beginning”)
Psalm 139:16 "You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!"

Paul was convinced that he had no free will. In his own words, everything he did was “according to God’s will” and “according to God’s plan”, not his own. He even refers to himself as “a prisoner” of God and Jesus.

If you think you’re making choices that determine whether or not you’re going to heaven, you’re sadly mistaken. The bible consistently says that those choices were chosen by God before time itself. Not by you, but clearly and definitely chosen by God.
Your choice is not a choice at all. The bible clearly teaches predestination.

There are only small percentages of abortions for those reasons. Also a study proved women who have abortions because of ** have a harder time healing from what has happened to them. So do you think it is acceptable to kill someone for their father’s crime?
“What if the child is going to be born with a horrible disease that will make him or her suffer and not survive for any longer than a year?”
So in your opinion anyone who has a horrible disease shouldn’t be given a chance, a right, to live? So when we find children today who are fighting diseases should we just kill them too? I mean is not possible for them to overcome it and find some happiness?
“What if the child ends up for adoption, only to be lost and given up on in the foster care system?”
Just because someone is adopted does not mean that they will have miserable unsuccessful lives. Did you know that Faith Hill, Jamie Foxx, and Babe Ruth were adopted? So does this also mean we should kill anyone who is orphaned or might be?
“its a womens decision and you have no right to tell her what she can and can't do”
Yet that woman has the right to take the life of her own child? It’s a life not a choice. Life, LIFE, begins at fertilization. Consider how many people have died from abortion and not only that, but what the world has lost because someone thought they did not have the right to live.

To the post above.

"But WHY would God allow babies to be aborted?"

God gave us FREE WILL to choose between right and wrong. Also I'm not pro-life because of religion; I'm pro-life because it is MURDER. It has been proven scientifically that life begins at conception. They have their own DNA; a blueprint of what they will look like, their IQ level, everything.

One of my previous posts above states "I guess in according to some of the pro-choice comments that when we find a child that is unwanted, abused, or has a disease, we should kill them to put them out of their misery. Is this limited to just children or does this also apply to you. When people have a rough patch in life you believe it's impossible to overcome? My father was a victim of abuse, born, but unwanted so I guess his mother should have killed him right? I mean he was a child who was unwanted. So, what I'm gathering from the pro-choice point of view is that just because someone MAY have a sad moment in life we should kill them because there is no possible way for them to achieve happiness."

So why do you believe it is perfectly fine to kill someone who hasn’t even done anything other than be conceived?

Okay… I think I’m starting to understand.
If I didn’t attend YOUR church, I was following a false doctrine. How foolish of me!
As I’d been misled all that time, you probably understand the bible better than me. So let’s start right from the beginning.
God is omniscient… all knowing.
There is nothing He doesn’t know. He knows everything that has ever been and everything that will ever be. Everything that will ever come to pass for all time is according to His plan.
He knows every single person who has ever been born and every fetus that will ever be conceived. He deems when a woman’s egg is fertilized to become an embryo, because we are all created by Him.
He knows exactly what each and every one of us will do and think every single moment of our lives.
He knows the exact moment of each of our deaths.

If we change our minds about anything, He already knew that we would. We only think we’re changing our minds, but God already knows what we’re going to do. We are just following His plan.

He already knows that some of His creations will be terminated before they are born, by humans who He created and already knew what they would do. They are doing exactly what God KNEW they would do. Their entire lives are already known to God.

If a woman decides to not get an abortion, God already knew what her decision would be.
Likewise, when a woman decides to abort, God already KNEW that would happen.

But WHY would God allow babies to be aborted?

Wait, wait… I’ll get it… Yes!
“We are not meant to know the ways of God.”

See? I’m a better Christian already! : )

Yes, false claim to understanding. It doesn't matter how long you called yourself Christian as many who do don't understand it themselves; particularly those that follow any strain of Protestant/Lutheranism, but many Catholics also have a false understanding like Rudy Guiliannie, Nacy Pelosi, Biden, Richardson...

Calling it non-human before it can take a breath is obviously ignorant. Yo may not call it a person that deserves human rights, but it is human from teh moment of conception. Your little word play only eases your conscious, not the science.

I find it disturbing you use your illogic and unreasonableness to support something YOU want everyone else to do such as killing human beings, yet when asked to support your position you refer to a religious ideology (Jews) to support it, but not science, reason, or logic.

I find hillarious you define my position as strictly religious and not a human rights issue when you are the one who continuously brings up the religious element when I have kept it otherwise. You can't refute it on the science grounds, or natural law so you cry 'bible thumper' as a means to deflect the issue in a way to support your continued support for killing children at any stage of pregnancy. At least you have not tossed out the health/**/** as justification for all abortions- you don't care as long as you can still kill on a whim.

A false claim to understanding Christian theology?
I happen to had been a christian for more than 40 years.

While I don't follow or even condone Judaism, I do happen to agree with their belief that it isn't a human until it takes its first breath.

There are laws in place to prevent theft.
There are no laws in place to prevent a woman from having an abortion... at any stage of her pregnancy.

I find it hillarious that you want to use logic and reason and science to support something YOU want everyone else to do, but when asked to look at your own religion with those same tools, you blatantly refuse.

Make no mistakes. For you, this is definitely a religious issue, not a human rights issue.

I have been on BOTH sides of this.
Religion is baseless and hollow.

Yep, thre it is...the deflection. The only thing unfouded is the pro-abort defense and a false claim to understanding Christian theology as a means to attack the pro-life position.

What a stupid question. Why do ??% of thieves claim a religious affiliation? Does that make the theology wrong or the person? If a non-religious steals something, are they justified in stealing because they do not have a identifiable moral code as one who publically claims a religious faith?

If it is 'legal' to kill a child at 5-9 months gestation because the women decides she doens't want it anymore for non-**, non-**, non-health reasons...or because the ** hole father doesn't want the finacial obligation; why isn't it legal to steal food when hungry, or a car when you need transportation, or break into someones house for shelter?

Pro-aborts never defend their position with reason or logic, science or a moral code, instead they attack and whine against the opposition with smugness and mocking. A person who steals would prefer to be called 'possion challanged' rather than a thief. Someone who molests children might prefer to be refered to as caring and loving to children instead of the sick pervert they are. Those who kill or advocate killing for no justified reason may want to be called compassionate, dignified and tolerant of choice but in reality it is something else.

Yup. There it is.
"You have no morals!"

The battlecry of bible thumpers everywhere.
Completely unfounded, yet clung to as steadfast as the "good parts" of the bible.
Either you believe that Jesus told you to adhere to every last one of Moses' laws until the earth itself passes away, or you are nothing more than a hypocrit yourself.

Tell me. Why is it that 78% of mothers having abortions claim a religious affiliation?

I guess in according to some of the pro-choice comments that when we find a child that is unwanted, abused, or has a disease, we should kill them to put them out of their misery. Is this limited to just children or does this also apply to you. When people have a rough patch in life you believe it's impossible to overcome? My father was a victim of abuse, born, but unwanted so I guess his mother should have killed him right? I mean he was a child who was unwanted. So, what I'm gathering from the pro-choice point of view is that just because someone MAY have a sad moment in life we should kill them because there is no possible way for them to achieve happiness.

See, that is what is most ** up about you extreme secular pro-aborts. You think the hypocrisy of some Christian fundamentalists that support the illegal unjust war somehow justifies your extreme position too. It doesn't. Both are hypocrites. No biblical or reference to God has been made at all excpet by the secular pro-aborts due to their hatred of Christianity specifically, but all religion in general.

Secular pro-aborts are like Muslim murder-bombers in at least two respects: 1) They cite the Old Testament and cry 'look, God killed people on purpose' so we can too.' 2) They don't believe the Old or New Testaments are correct and reject the clear message of peace, love, and protection/nurture of life for all humanity (to include the unborn); yet use it to brow beat the Christians who claim to beleive it but fail to uphold it.

Face it pro-aborts: you are bankrupt in morality and exhibit intellectual dishonesty in your unhinged defense of abortion when it clearly violates the natural law, civil law, common sense and common decency- all in an effort to convince yourself killing an unborn child when not due to **, **, mothers life in danger (1%) to allow the killing of 7 month, 8 month, and 9 month old children of the womb because you might have been a stupid lazy **.

If the ectopic abortion is permitted for valid reasons so to must partial birth/late term abortions.
http://www.lifeissues.org/images/PBA.jpg

twisted **

What's really twisted is all you right wing bible thumpers crying that abortion is so very wrong and then spend your sundays worshipping a god who ordered the slaughter of newborns by the thousands, the murder of thousands upon thousands of inocents and even aborted millions of unborn when he supposedly flooded the entire earth.

"Let he who is without sin... blah, blah, blah"

So a 'law' that is not a law, is very clear about being a 'law'?
'** the innocent'
'who gives a ** if a baby is born'

twisted **.

maybe YOU should get education ya dumb **